Let's talk LCS

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May 2012

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May 28 - Memorial Day

[Payton999 Robonaught]

Carter, you tried, but it was nearly impossible without your presence to support and push the scenario.  I would like to see the project at least get a fair shot, and am willing to do whatever I can, for Treve, to see this through.  I remember the old days of GM/GLM and while I've never been much of a combat person, the consensus that I've heard (despite the earlier bugs that  turned me off personally) is that LCS seems to offer a great new way to actually, realistically, "battle" in SL. 

That said, and as Tyr's so bravely encountered, it can be a traffic killer.  Yes, it seems we've gotten so lazy that while we change hair and dress daily, the matter of a meter is one that might be a sim killer.  In the interests of those who play and enjoy  themselves in Treve, I'd not like to make a move without a general consensus, so I'm opening this up for Trevans (please only!) to oppose if they have a strong objection to a trial of the LCS meter on our sim.  Of course, this would be paired with numerous sims, all participating in the same trial, the same time period.  IF we find that it's not keeping folks happy, then we re-evaluate, and as always do the best we can for the majority of the players who call Treve home.

Thanks.

xx Pay

[Payton999 Robonaught]

Posted on behalf of Mr Grumpypants:

[19:58]  ℜ (rancher.koenig): its simple
[19:58]  ℜ (rancher.koenig): if it ain't broke....don't fix it
[19:59]  ℜ (rancher.koenig): Treve has MORE rp then most of gor combined...why would you throw somethign into the mix that WILL change that when obviously you're doing just fine now

[Ganesh Westland]

Exactly..Treve is one of the hoghest traffic sims. And in a position to set a trend. If it´s a trend that leads to more realistic combat..then im all for it. The thing is..combat in SL Gor IS broken..there are so many things just wrong with the GM, but people have adapted to them, learned to live with them. GM is the perfect meter for those who enjoy pewpew..let them keep it. I choose btb Gor because I enjoy realistic gorean roleplay. And fighting is a part of that. Why strive for realistic RP..if i get off the road halfway and end up in a clicking orgy?

Im sure in a joint effort of some of the leading Sims..LCS can replace the Gm. I do hope so.

[Caliway]

If people went with the idea of "If it ain't broke don't fix it" we would be using Rotary phones. watching Silent Movies, and driving horse and Buggies.

The LCS is a Better Meter.  I have been testing it in Saphronicus, we Like it. 

[Payton999 Robonaught]

I like rotary phones!   

[Caliway]

I like rotary phones!   

* Caliway spanks Payton..

[Ronald Petlyakov]

The Lcs meter as it is now, is not a better meter. I do not think so.

It opens doors for many unwelcome solutions and abuses.

I have tested it recently and I'm not impressed. Not realy.

First off, the combat especialy the melee one does not demand more skill nor offer more realism to its participants. If anything, It is now more random and dependand on preset values.

I can see already all the men changing their shapes. Making them taller and their shoulders broader to the point they look like apes just so they can deal more damage on the meter. The panthers on the other hand will all turn their height to three feet so they can run around you like pigmeys and take you down with few well aimed shots. Thats right. Arrows can be realy deadly now. Few (5) well aimed shots and your target is a gonner. This is much deadlier than GM is right now and if you dont like splash hits, which I dont. Just turn of Splash hits on GM meter server and Voila. Your GM bow combat will be fixed.

Getting back to the melee combat though.
I can't realy voice my support to a metter that sets the sign of equality between every randomly hitting newbie and an experienced fighter. Hitting and blocking, they're alldependant from magicaly implemented into the metter values.

I can see the sudden influx of torvaldslander now. Everyone is gonna have torvie heritage. you wait for it.

I've tested this matter with a warrior. His meter was set to a 'warrior' and my to an assassin and as we fought certain matter came to light. I have managed to dance around him. Hit him more and even block some of his hits. It didnt matter. Just because he was a warrior he was able to hit me for 2 points more on each hit. Because I was an assassin, he was able to hit me for for further few points more (1-2)on every hit and so, if you consider that it takes about 10 hits to take someone down:


10hits x 4points differance =40 points of damage.
So the warrior is nearly 40 % deadlier 1on1 ?

I refuse to support the metter which empowers newbies, apes and makes supperior fighters out of players who hit randomly and without a thought but they click and play the warrior caste.

[Grondar Quartz]

Why not do as Venna did Pay and set up a sky platform with LCS on itr so people can try for themselves, Patrik the maker seesm to be very helpfulw with any issues people have I am sure a lot of people on the sim havent even heard of LCS , see what our citizens want , I obviously have no idea whats involved in setting up a platform and testing area adn I can only just about make a poster for the BOW, so if its far to much work then ok it was only a suggestion , personally I liked the LCS meter as Ron says the bow is powerful but as far as I can recall you have to aim more and not just run round machine gunning stuff.

[Ganesh Westland]

You have a good Point Ron... now here comes the but.

Isnt that how it should be? Isnt the Assassin commonly seen as swift, and witty fighter, that relays more on skill then brute force? Isnt a Warrior on Gor the ultimate fighter that has little match other then a fellow warrior? Isnt the only realistic chance a Panther girl would have against such a warrior, a few well aimed shots and her advanced movement in the woods?

Maybe lets rephrase and call LCS the more realistic meter, that fits others better then GM. I for one, have seen enough of the GM. A few days ago, I was downed in a melee fight against a panther, using a sword with 35% dmg and the strike type pick axe. Ridiculous. As long as weapon makers care more about selling their stuff then realism..Gor is well served with a meter that strives for realismn. Which the GM, simply cant.

[Ronald Petlyakov]

You have a good Point Ron... now here comes the but.

Isnt that how it should be? Isnt the Assassin commonly seen as swift, and witty fighter, that relays more on skill then brute force?

the skill isnt reflected in the meter though. Its all about who can land the harder hit and warriors are second only to Torvies.

Assassins where the dark warriors who could stand againts warrior compared in swordmanship but here they don't. Besides fencing is not reflected in the meter either. Personally I dislike anything that promotes players because of their class, colour of their eyes or lenght of their avatar's arms.

Gm offers equal grounds for everyone.
If a pick axe wielding panthers takes you down, then perhaps it would be worth to reconsider spending some time in the Arena and practicing. Clearly her prowess reflects the time she spent on mastering her fighting.

If she spent time to keep her sharp edge why should she lose with you? Do you think that only because you play a warrior you should always win by default? even if you dont put the effort into training?

[Ganesh Westland]

Its not about winning by default. Im fine with beeing bested by a better swordsman. My point is the ridiculous strike type that makes no sense other then giving females another opportunity in Gor to be equal. Leave that kinda stuff for GE. We both choosed btb roleplay for different aspects I suppose..but in my books..females werent anywhere near equal. Not in strength, nor skill with blades. LCS atleast makes an attempt to fix that.

[Victor Warilard]

I have to agree with Ron on this one. Becoming very good with weapons, whether melee or with a bow, takes a lot of skill and practice. Substituting that for the meter pretty much deciding who is better rewards the lazy. GM already has a "weaker female options". Females can't use melee stronger than a spear. A good swordsman has a huge advantage provided they have are reasonably proficient, but a panther who is skilled with her weapons can still beat a man who is not. Personally, I think that is how it should be. If we make it so it is almost impossible for panthers to win in combat we seem like cowards who are afraid of women. We might as well put up a sign saying they are not welcome because they won't come here.  Furthermore, if this meter means the size and shape of your avatar affects your performance, that should make it a non-starter anyway.

Gron's idea is a good one if people really want to try this out: Set up a skybox arena for people to spar and practice. This will allow it to be tested without disrupting role-play on the sim.

[Grondar Quartz]

Gron's idea is a good one if people really want to try this out: Set up a skybox arena for people to spar and practice. This will allow it to be tested without disrupting role-play on the sim.

Hey I had a good Idea !!!#quick mark it on the calendar , (might not happen again)

[panzerwaffen]

i use to play as a panther
i was searching information about lcs meter ..but after i read 6 topics...i get dissapointed totaly
(2 was on this forume..some in other sources...)
it is poor competition meter
most panthers are players firstly...not BTB..just get fun...and RP.
gor GE for me = FPS+RPG+fun+emotions.
most people in BTB dont tell truth why they dont like GM...it is their bad combat skills..i dont talk about treve now..as it has some good fighters....but most are bad actualy and in this FPS game you need 2-3 red caste to get 1 panther in average....i hope it dont violate your limits..joke..
oh....and high stats will be only one ability to jerk-merc or red caste jerk to atack panters in wood...but it will not happen as most people will use GM meter. and stat difference between caste and race..are realy big... But..the most fun will be in cities...why assasin or scribe must lose to warrior all the time.....it is field of abuse..as in BTB sims warrior-jerks from big clan will claim FC of another players..just to make people feel bad...all will happen here...if you are so BTB..do you rember law of north (just example).....

also about lag...use same detector as in gimli..it ejects overscripted people...

in GM you know nothing about your enemie if you just look at him/her first time...nothing about bow skills...etc..tactics you can underestimate and lose...or act carefully and win.......in LCS people will stay away from warrior-orc of 80 level....or wil bring same warrior-orc..then they will stand in front of each other and will fight..with orcish blood exe ..lol....

But RED caste people that played FPS before are able to fight in gm and be "realistic"...and there is not a problem for them to down panther..or kicked ass to 2 outlaws...

mellee weapon is good aslo..many just need to know how to use it....and it is deadly in combination with bow....i was downed or get extara damage when didnt expect this type of fight..inspite i use it by myself
but as i know...people whin when somebody fight mixed way...like fast change

personaly i dont go to BTB sims much and to lag-pew-pew-silly-oultaw sims also....but it depends on what people like....i think it will only separate big and cool game into small parts..then you will get fixed price on LCS something like 995 lindens ..and will play gor-craft in few BTB islands...

oh..and about machine gun...nobody asks warriors to come to panther sims... .they can stay in cities and play master-slave with kajiras...GM is what most people like ..it is machine gun FPS..after fight they RP each time new ...and interesting..way....it can be another meter with equal stats and equal weapon.....personaly i get disney show all the time i fight btb warriors or mercs...because of drama and IMS bitching....like "tell her to ask excuse or i tp out..".."or you primshooted us.."......or even worther
oh..and btw city warriors are poor shooters...i know only few that are good...

P.S
BTW have you watched "south park" about "world or warcraft.."..level and experience and stats will make it gor-craft...lol.....with same consiquences....

but now i understood waht lcs is eheh..and will add it to my limits...
..no scat...
...no childplay....
..no LCS....
..no mutilation...
..no cheaters.....

[Toihva Svenson]

Gm offers equal grounds for everyone.

Here is the problem, Gor should NOT be equal for everyone.   As many have said, Gor aint fair.   Stop using a meter that very much espouses that.   Melee option may work, but most Panthers will use a bow which has no penalty to it.

As far as shapes the shapes issue, hate to tell you, but it is here now in GM.

I'd rather have LCS with its bugs, which hell GM even had when it first came out, than the machine gun bows of GM.