White Silk Slaves and Sexuality

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May 2012

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May 28 - Memorial Day

[Kiana Kuhr]

Just to clarify, by white silk, I mean, literally, virgin (you know, like in the books?) and not some ridiculous training silk level.

Why, oh why do slavers and other slaves in SL Gor (and probably others too) insist that white silks cannot do or think anything sexual? This is sooooo extraordinarily ridiculous and I cannot even imagine what prompts them to believe that a woman who is a virgin has no sexual needs or desires. In fact, the books explain exactly the contrary. Take Doreen, in Dancer, a white silk when she arrives on Gor, yet she's got some serious needs. So why do sims insist upon putting in their slave rules that white silks cannot even emote sexually? (Yes, I just read this sin a sim's rules that touts itself as fullly "BTB".) Why could a white silk not act sexual? There a a thousand ways to be sensual and sexual without having intercourse.

Don't you want any slave being trained to be a pleasure slave, regardless of white silk or red silk, to be sexual? Why is it that there are these ridiculous restrictions like "no sexual emotes" placed upon white silks?

[Canicus]

I have never seen a "No sexual emotes" restriction placed on a slave, regard of whatever colour silks. To me that is not IC guidance but more a failed attempt at OOC control.

Really it comes down to the slave. They can roleplay how they wish, post how they wish and all those glorious things.

[Kiana Kuhr]

I can pass you a notecard in world and show it to you in fact. You will likely faint when you see which sim it's from. But, it's not just that sim. It's actually a really prevalent idea in many RP sims, it seems ( this shocked me as much as the "slaves can use any verb tense" rule in another RP sims slave rules. Lol!

[Canicus]

Catigernus Resident, pass it over then.

[Liara Edring]

               *******                   White Silk - AKA Virgin                      *******

This role is usually best for completely new to Gor players. It is also a hard role to take on. This gives you time to learn the basics. how to greet, how to serve. Also give you time to learn what needs to be.

Now if you choose to become a White Silk you need to behave in a certain way. You are a Virgin. You will kneel with your legs shut at all times. You don't offer the men what they cannot have.  Your emotes will be reserved and not so much as sensual as the redslks. You could even have a chastity belt given or Rply worn so you can not be touched. Once your training is complete you will be blood auctioned off. 

IF you are Role playing a white silk you are not to have any form of sexual role play. You are not able to bathe, fur or dance for the men!!

A Blood Auction is basically a highest bidder gets your virginity. This can be done a few ways. They can put you to the block and have a simple bidding war on you. Most coin wins. Or you can Dance show off what you learn and then the highest bidder wins. Either way the highest bidder in RP coins. Gets to have you for X amount of time to Fur you to open you!

And then later:

2. White silks again No furring No bathing No dancing until the blood auction. Your a prize protect it!

Basically, these are guidelines for the camp sluts, and I think that it's more along the lines of making sure girls don't offer more than they can deliver (especially if belted).

[Kiana Kuhr]

I really think the sim owners maybe don't read what is being promoted in there sim.  It's often full of crap like this, especially slave info and rules. Where in the books is this mentality? I don't recall reading it at all.

[Elle Couerblanc]

Okay two things I am going to say here and I will say no more. 

Where I agree with you: Kiana you are absolutely correct.  This information does not have book support at all and I will be more than happy to talk to the folks in this sim.

Where I don't agree with you:  For me personally, it looks like you are trying to call out a certain popular sim for some reason today.  Why not maybe perhaps contact someone you know from the sim privately and have a discussion first before coming here.  I just feel it's just more respectful I think to do it that way then to put it out there on a public forum.

[Kiana Kuhr]

I was using a living example and one I experienced recently. That is all. It's actually the perfect example given that I know the sim owners of this sim really promote IC and OOC separation and a "BTB" approach. I am sure it's pretty similar in other sims too. I've also talked about another (different and unrelated) sim I visited recently that had some pretty odd and ridiculous slave rules too. I think it lends credence to the argument when you can use an actual example instead of blowing hot air. If it makes people uncomfortable to discuss real examples, I'm not really sure what to say. I would not mind someone discussing my sim in a constructive way because I believe others can see what I may not realize or be aware of.

ETA: You and I spoke in PM Elle so you know a lot more than other people reading this...I wasn't even in this sim on Kiana, so no one would even know unless they knew the rules that Lia posted or unless someone else says which sim it is. I purposely did not mention it because the point of the thread is not about a specific sim, but instead a practice that seems a bit widespread, from my experience over the years.

Please do not make this into something it's not. It's a discussion and nothing else. I have nothing personal against any sim but simply wish to improve everyone's experience by bringing this sort of thing to light because if it's happening in some of our more popular RP sims that are marketed with a strong separation of IC and OOC, then I see this is a quite a big problem.

[dana Tehani]

hmm lol

I am gonna have to say, where does it say white silk girls cant emote sexually or emote needs?

It merely says they are vigins.. and as per the books, umm they are!?!?!?!?!!?

[Kiana Kuhr]

Dana,

It says right here:

Now if you choose to become a White Silk you need to behave in a certain way. You are a Virgin. You will kneel with your legs shut at all times. You don't offer the men what they cannot have.  Your emotes will be reserved and not so much as sensual as the redslks.

You don't get to offer yourself since men can't have you. Your emotes have to be reserved. My question is why? Why would you cut off that avenue of RP for someone? What if they are a reallllly sensual and needy white silk because they are bred into slavery and have spent half their life in a stim cage? They can't emote that story because of why? Because of a very limited and narrow view associated with purity and virginity on earth that is not even part of the books? Also, since when does the manner of kneeling have anything to do with virginity or not. Slaves of either red or white silk variety can kneel in whichever manner is required of them. A slave can be a white silk pleasure slave...she's simply unopened yet, but she could still kneel in nadu like a pleasure slave does.

[dana Tehani]

restricted slaves shouldnt offer themselves sexually that would indeed be against their owner!. They can however rp needs etc and even rp wishing to be opened lol but I would think a whitesilk unless defying her owner, wouldnt dare show need to someone .. I know many quotes for whitesilks where a man asks them to do something and they say "But I am a whitesilk". Just means IC they should ensure they say so.. having said that, if they dont.. its on them and can be hanled ICly. I also saw where a girl begged to be used and the man said no as she was whitesilk. I'm sure if he owner knew she'd be in trouble

[Kiana Kuhr]

It's an IC issue not an OOC one so it should not be addressed by an OOC rule. In affect, the rules read as saying not to RP that angle, when the RP angle is completely valid.

As far as a slave showing need or begging being against her owner...I disagree. I don't think all slaves are loyal to their owners for one, and also, even some that are would still beg men to use them. It's not earth and there is no such thing as cheating. It's not abnormal for a slave on gor to have sexual feelings that are insatiable and that she may beg any man to fulfill, particularly if she is a pleasure slave. It doesn't make her a bad slave either. I would think a man would find this kind of hot to see a woman so much in need for a man's touch.

I think that people are applying earth moralities to gorean slavery and it's simply not possible. It's a whole different mindset. SLaves are meant to be helpless before men, especially sexually, so I don't think most pleasure slaves or ones in training to be full blown pleasure slaves are gonna have a switch that flips off their sexuality suddenly just because its not their own owner. That's kind of silly if you ask me.

[dana Tehani]

It's an IC issue not an OOC one so it should not be addressed by an OOC rule. In affect, the rules read as saying not to RP that angle, when the RP angle is completely valid.

As far as a slave showing need or begging being against her owner...I disagree. I don't think all slaves are loyal to their owners for one, and also, even some that are would still beg men to use them. It's not earth and there is no such thing as cheating. It's not abnormal for a slave on gor to have sexual feelings that are insatiable and that she may beg any men to fulfill, particularly if she is a pleasure slave.

thats fine then.. if she isnt loyal and discovered, she can take IC consequences.. its just not that hard 

[Liara Edring]

restricted slaves shouldnt offer themselves sexually that would indeed be against their owner!. They can however rp needs etc and even rp wishing to be opened lol but I would think a whitesilk unless defying her owner, wouldnt dare show need to someone .. I know many quotes for whitesilks where a man asks them to do something and they say "But I am a whitesilk". Just means IC they should ensure they say so.. having said that, if they dont.. its on them and can be hanled ICly. I also saw where a girl begged to be used and the man said no as she was whitesilk. I'm sure if he owner knew she'd be in trouble

The rule, so far as I know, is not directed towards private slaves.  It's for the Camp Sluts.

But, again, as I said in my initial post, from what I gather, the position of "White Silk Virgin" is being presented as a good role for someone very new to Gor and RP.  In my opinion, the rule (while probably badly phrased) is meant to make sure that the prospective White Silk understands her role. Also, consider this: we're talking about an Outlaw Camp in the middle of the wilderness.  The odds of a White Silk bred slave falling into their hands without being raped first are nil.  The majority of White Silks are going to be FW captives brought back from cities (assuming they aren't just raped first) and, possibly, Barbarians found from crashed voyages or some such.  In that context, and given what they are saying about training, we're talking about raw, new girls who would not ICly be spreading their legs willingly, for the most part.

But I think, too, Kiana, that you need to be careful about how you phrase what you're saying.  I know you mean well, but I also know that to some people you are coming across as someone trying to tear down their sim.  

[Kiana Kuhr]

It's not about a specific sim. So if people want to take it that way, there is no real way to combat that. And it's a concept that is widely spread throughout sl gor. I've seen it on countless sims over the years. People can take things personally or they can join in a discussion that is about an idea that their sim may or may not embrace.

I was just mulling this over when I went outside to smoke...

Pleasure slaves on Gor are helpless to men because of one main thing- their sexuality. If a slave can readily control the expression of her sexuality, then she's not all that helpless to men. Of course, I wouldn't expect a newly captured free woman or even an earth barbarian to be willingly juicing all over men. At least not right away. But I don't think it would take her all that long to get there if she has been deemed fit to be a pleasure slave. I don't think this has any bearing on her silk status necessarily. I just feel that rules should not inhibit roles in a manner that is not in line with what's in the books.